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(!'pictures of people' & ~~"huh?") 17:52:14 something at http://www.tunes.org/files/papers/Arrow_Introduction_v8.htm reminds me of something written by Buckminster Fuller. if the explanation was in simpler terms, it might be helpful for folks. 17:52:20 anyway, have fun 17:52:21 [QUIT] rares quit: [x]chat 17:52:23 and thanks 17:52:25 sc left #tunes 17:53:02 he'z right 17:58:37 rmm, what was that? 18:31:50 buckminster fuller 18:38:07 eihrul: how's progress on 'leak'? 18:38:17 eihrul shrugs. 18:38:29 right now working on slate 18:39:14 what's a good ide/editor for windows? 19:01:46 enfinity joined #tunes 19:05:55 Kyle_L joined #tunes 19:10:10 [QUIT] billh quit: BitchX-1.0c16 -- just do it. 21:57:10 water joined #tunes 21:57:46 'lo 21:59:59 hey water 22:00:05 hey 22:00:11 hows it goin today 22:00:19 not bad i suppose 22:00:33 i've been working on documentation outlines 22:00:39 oh? 22:00:47 for slate? 22:01:02 yeah figuring out how to organise explanations for slate is difficult 22:01:07 (and for arrow) 22:01:11 i'd imagine 22:02:44 i need to read back over arrow a few times 22:02:44 i have a large collection of concrete things to say about arrow, but i can't put them together properly 22:02:57 no, ignore that paper 22:03:08 heh. both versions? 22:03:12 it's not doing the job that people need it to 22:03:20 yes, both versions 22:03:36 i think it'd help to have examples 22:03:36 it's a good paper, but not for explaining 22:03:44 no kidding 22:03:57 but that's a wide-open suggestion 22:04:02 yeah 22:05:04 maybe there should be an emulator 22:05:20 have you looked at the smalltalk code? 22:05:28 nope 22:05:31 where at? 22:05:37 check my homepage 22:05:40 ok 22:07:17 tunes.org/~water ? 22:07:30 it loads in squeak, and i could port it to other smalltalks pretty trivially 22:07:33 yeah 22:07:41 hmm. i see where you have info about it 22:07:46 just no link to it 22:07:52 hm... looking 22:07:53 only lisp evaluator 22:07:56 yeah it's there 22:08:13 under the arrow heading, "prototype code" is the link 22:08:27 ok 22:08:37 ah there it is 22:09:04 not sure i understand enough of squeak to make use of it.. but ill try 22:09:28 it's just an object-oriented spec 22:09:46 block-indentation shows where method code is 22:10:05 and i made sure to comment it as well as i could think of 22:10:15 i see 22:10:55 hm 22:12:02 i think i know how i could significantly improve it 22:12:19 yeah? 22:12:51 yeah, there's some things i discussed with people in december or so that were significant and yet simple 22:13:08 i believe it's on the mlist 22:13:15 water looks into the archives 22:18:32 yeah the two system graphs 'car' and 'cdr' (i never did find better names for them) 22:19:24 hmm. i remember something to do w/ that 22:22:10 yeah and also 'apply' 22:23:45 damn it, my squeak image is all dis-organized now 22:23:58 time to re-build it 22:25:29 squeak is interesting 22:25:42 yeah but it's got a long way to go 22:25:45 seems to be a 'play thing'.. but i found irc and a web browser 22:25:52 right 22:26:02 wish it was faster under X 22:26:05 the web browser is getting some serious updates 22:26:14 water is on the squeak mlist 22:26:53 morphic UI is nice.. but seems annoying 22:27:10 hit wrong mouse button and you end up changing things 22:27:10 which parts in particular? 22:27:14 oh 22:27:31 not sure i like it where you modify properties w/ right or whatever mouse button 22:27:31 well, you can turn that off 22:27:36 oh 22:27:58 open preferences... pick simple halos 22:28:13 there are other things you can do as well 22:28:21 unfortunately, it's not the default 22:28:29 and it's not trivial 22:28:47 heh yeah 22:29:11 the problem is that core morphic is getting overhauled and it will change a lot of things.... the ease of use factors are supposed to get fixed right then 22:29:47 if you look at the "morph" class you'll see why there needs to be change :) 22:30:03 heh. 22:30:15 considering i dont know smalltalk i think i'll stay away for a bit 22:30:36 you can get tutorials 22:30:47 yeah i saw a few 22:30:58 damn, not right now though... the squeak site wiki is down :/ 22:30:59 just need to find time to read them 22:32:10 finally got around to reading, or re-reading a lisp tut 22:32:16 ok 22:32:23 just need to make a program to make sure i understand it all 22:37:46 water grabs squeak 2.8 22:38:12 heh. 22:38:19 figures. i just got 2.7 couple days ago 22:38:19 squeakaholic 22:38:33 2.8 is still beta 22:38:40 ah 22:38:58 i was alpha testing until the update stream just skyrocketed 22:39:13 i couldn't keep up 22:39:43 eihrul joined #tunes 22:39:47 re eih 22:39:54 isn't there is squeak OS? 22:39:58 re 22:40:08 yeah, oskit-enabled :) 22:40:15 yeah that was what i saw 22:40:32 fits on a floppy, though 22:40:45 probably wont like my hardware tho 22:41:04 what's odd about your hw? 22:41:24 nothing really i suppose 22:41:45 not sure how it gets into higher video modes 22:42:14 yeah there are differences i suppose 22:52:04 darn 56k modem... it takes forever to get a big download 22:52:13 yeah 22:52:25 i finally got cable modem last month 22:52:36 major improvement 22:52:47 i'm still waiting.... it's supposed to be soon 22:52:58 @home ? 22:53:17 no 22:53:40 or did you mean that as in "are you at home?"? 22:53:46 no heh 22:53:52 i meant is that the cable supplier 22:54:03 no, some local company 22:54:11 oh 22:54:50 i need some friggin tools 22:54:59 tools? 22:55:02 like a scanner or a digital cam 22:55:05 oh. 22:55:09 same here 22:55:10 or a stylus pad 22:55:20 i definately need a printer 22:55:30 nah screw printers 22:55:40 its a pain to read all these docs on a screen 22:55:45 there's only one direction i want info to go in :) 22:55:52 bah 22:55:53 heh 22:56:05 i've read cs papers on my pda (RIP) 22:56:14 i can't wait until some of the digital paper technologies become mainstream 22:56:29 ick 22:56:46 water had a cassiopeia e-100 22:56:50 i dont think i could read anything on a 4" palm 22:56:54 it ran squeak :) 22:57:01 hehe. nice 22:57:15 i saw a few pda screenshots running squeak 22:57:19 and a digital cam 22:57:25 yep 22:58:18 i'm waiting for a good pda based on strongarm to come out 22:58:33 whys that 22:58:54 because running squeak will be much less cramped on it 22:59:04 oh 22:59:06 and having a pda is very useful for me 22:59:22 (especially while at work and commuting on the ferry) 22:59:27 yeah 22:59:38 that's 12 hours a day 23:00:06 though wireless inet is costly.. unless you dont plan on using inet 23:00:20 no i don't care for wireless right now 23:01:18 i'd just like something small and powerful as a PC, but lasts 20 hours on a few batteries 23:01:32 yeah 23:01:59 good lcd screens suck power though 23:02:06 yeah 23:03:19 just got a used thinkpad p150 to find out the battery is dead 23:03:47 not that it'd last much more than an hour and half 23:17:49 hm squeak 2.8 seems quite a bit faster 23:19:18 much different from 2.7? 23:19:28 still looking 23:19:42 the new vm has the speedups 23:21:03 [QUIT] eihrul quit: [x]chat 23:21:13 i think im getting the hang of morphic 23:25:00 smoke joined #tunes 23:31:39 wow. thats cool stuff 23:31:47 what is? 23:31:52 morphic 23:31:59 yeah it can be 23:32:08 i was messing w/ sketcheditor 23:32:39 with which? 23:32:46 huh? 23:32:59 what's stetcheditor? 23:33:07 er sketch 23:33:16 its in the 'standard parts' dialog 23:33:22 oh that 23:33:55 everything is rotateable or resizable dynamically 23:35:45 you can play with thinglab, too (an extra) 23:36:08 not part of the image? 23:36:17 not that i know of 23:36:22 oh 23:36:40 it's in the goodies directory of the squeak ftp 23:36:49 ok 23:37:31 i think there is more in squeak than all my X programs combined 23:37:39 hm 23:38:01 no there's a lot missing 23:38:31 guess so. 23:38:43 of course it's much more productive if you code it in squeak ;) 23:38:58 yeah heh 00:29:49 hm